Setting up a Lake Malawi Tank

[bronzefighter]

Hello! After much deliberation, I think I've settled on starting a dwarf mbuna tank. Since my experience with Cichlid's is limited to some GBR's and Angels, I thought I'd turn the Box for some guidance.

Here's what I have so far:

55g, with about 100lbs of Mexican Pot Rock setup with some intricate caves and such.

Substrate is 20lbs of CaribSea Ocean Direct Oolite Live Sand and 20lbs CaribSea African Cichlid mix, along with a bit of random gravel.

Filtration is an AC110 (which I might supplement with an AC30 that I have laying around), and a bubble wall to provide surface agitation.


Now, on to the questions!

• As far as stocking, I have no idea where to begin. I would like a diverse population, with as many different colors and species represented. If that means only 2 different species due to the size of my tank, so be it! I honestly have no clue here (yet).
  
• I know that I need hard, alkaline water for these guys (which is why I chose the substrates that I did), what is the 'best' way to achieve ideal water quality?
  
• What is the ideal way to actually introduce fish to the tank? Should I purchase a large amount of juvies, or can I introduce them a few at a time?
  
• My friend has an adult Yellow Lab, would it be appropriate to put him in my tank for the time being and introduce more fish later?

Anyways, I'm at work now, and will post some pictures later this evening. Thanks for reading!

 

[Anthraxx]

to start i would reccomend that you consider upgrading the filter to a canister. something that would turn over the 55g over like 8-10 times per hour. if thats too much then you can supplement it with things like sponge filters and powerheads. both give increased flow and help to keep the water oxygenated.
All that being said mbuna typically will require a heavy stockload in order to help alleviate stress on females. for many species the 1m-4f ratio will do just fine, some require many more females as they tend to be on the aggressive side. mbuna will also readily crossbred within species that typically closely resemble each other. for instance yellow lab x red zebra cross is what you see at most petcos labeled under yellow lab. in this sense its best to avoid picking species with common traits, verticle barring, lateral stripes, similar colors, etc.
I think your on the right track considering lab's as one of your species. they are known for being very peaceful and add a nice splash of color. other common starters include yellow tail acei, Rusties, and im sure somebody else will chime in with others. i believe three species is about all you can ask for in a tank that size. ill share with you a couple of links to maybe help influence your descision http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/african_cichlid_genus_gallery.php

just keep this thread active theres a few others that should be able to help as well. GL to ya

 

[DMD123]

A higher turn over rate like Anthraxx mentioned is a good idea. The AC110 is a good filter but likelihood is you would do best by adding one more AC110 or a canister.

 

[bronzefighter]

Here's what I've got so far:

Upgrading the filter is planned in the future as well.

What is the best way to actually introduce fish into the tank?

 

[DMD123]

Nice pics! Looks like you will have some happy fish.

 

[Betty]

The setup looks very nice.  If your filter is already cycled, (my opinion from past experience) the best way to introduce fish is all at once as juvies. If you can't do it that way, starting with the least aggressive species might be the way to go and when you do add more, add a group -- not just one or two at a time.  This will help spread the aggression that will be directed toward the newcomers.  Some have had good results with moving rocks around to change up territories when introducing new fish to an established tank, but I've never had much luck doing that.

I don't add anything to the water in most of my tanks, but you can purchase cichlid 'salts' or make your own.  There are recipes online.

Choosing stock is the hard part and the fun part!  There are so many options.  Do you plan to have the fish breed?

 

[bronzefighter]

Choosing stock is the hard part and the fun part!  There are so many options.  Do you plan to have the fish breed?

Possibly. I've heard that as long as you have correct water parameters and fed properly they will breed on their own. At the moment I don't plan on encouraging it, but if it happens than it happens!

 

[Anonymous]

The setup looks very nice.  If your filter is already cycled, (my opinion from past experience) the best way to introduce fish is all at once as juvies. If you can't do it that way, starting with the least aggressive species might be the way to go and when you do add more, add a group -- not just one or two at a time.  This will help spread the aggression that will be directed toward the newcomers.  Some have had good results with moving rocks around to change up territories when introducing new fish to an established tank, but I've never had much luck doing that.

I don't add anything to the water in most of my tanks, but you can purchase cichlid 'salts' or make your own.  There are recipes online.

Choosing stock is the hard part and the fun part!  There are so many options.  Do you plan to have the fish breed?

:iagree:  Have fun with africans?

 

[master chi]

I think the AC110 is a great start for filtering. I would be rid of any carbon inserts that came with it,and instead add another biofoam insert for the 110.
Then take the AC 30 and place nothing but extra mechanical filtration .
I use the same setup except My 55 runs an AC70,and an AC50. The 70 has 2 Biosponges,the 50 has 3 scrubber sponges for mechanical filtering.
It works wonderfully,and for the money is more thrifty than a canister filter.
The only true drawback of using all HOB filters is the noise you get from the outlets pouring into the tank. If that doesn't bother you it should be great.

As far as water parameters,and getting getting them to match the lake, You would be best adding crushed coral in a filter bag and adding that into maybe the AC 50 as well.

Personally, I just use CaribSea African Cichlid sand ,in tank. My PH stays at 8.0,but some people think that substrate as a way to continually buffer water is not reliable.
I do tend to disagree with that based on my experience though.
Also making your own cichlid salt is super cheap. the amount of epsom salt,and baking soda will vary depending on your tap water,but basically all you need to do is.....

Add about 1tsp of baking soda per 5 gallons of dechlorinated water.then slowly add more to adjust,until your ph is around8.0 to 8.4,
then repeat the process using epsom salt,looking for a dgh between 15-25,
then again repeat adding 1tsp of regular non iodized table salt or marine salt per 5 gallons of water.
Once you figure out the best formula for your water,then you can just mix up a big batch and add it during water changes.
Way cheaper than buying the store buffers,and it has exactly the same ingredients.

Now choosing dwarf species isn't that difficult,but you really only need to know what exactly is a dwarf mbuna.
While many do say yellow Labs are dwarf mbuna,I have seen them get a little larger than 6'',so goes the same for Rusties.
While that size for those 2 species isn't common ,if they were to reach that size,they would not be dwarf mbuna.
Dwarf mbuna should not get larger than 4'',if so only to 5'' tops. That leaves the 2 previously stated species,as well as just about any Cynotilapia,Ps.Saulosi,and Ps.Demasoni.
Since Demasoni,and Saulosi should not be kept together,you can only choose 1 of those species. If you choose saulosi,then you have to avoid Yellow Labs,because female Saulosi are also yellow,and they will crossbreed.
The Cynotilapia group is exclusively dwarf,but they are also all blue barred species. meaning you won't have much luck keeping them with Saulosi,or Demasoni,with the exception probably being Cyno. sp. Hara,because although they are blue barred,their bodies,especially males is more of a very light blue,and look fairly different than Saulosi,or Demasoni.
So the suggestion then would be as follows.....

Ps. Saulosi
Iodotropheus Sprengerea,AKA Rusties
Cyno.Sp.Hara

or...

Labidochromis Caereleus
Ps. Demasoni
Iodotropheus Sprengerea


On how to introduce the fish,it is definitely best to add all juvies in the tank together.
Adding 1 species starting with the least aggressive species ,and ending with the most aggressive is likely the 2nd best option.
Adding 1 adult,then adding other fish later as  you gain them won't be terrible,if all the other added fish are juvies,as adults tend not to bother them until they are sexually mature.
And of finally,the worst possible way to add mbuna to a tank is adding adult fish 1 at a time,this is definitely to a good idea. The new fish will always get picked on,probably to death.

 

[bronzefighter]

Ok, so I think I've figured out my stocking a bit. I'm thinking some like the following:

Pseudotropheus demasoni x 5

Labidochromis Caereleus x 5

Iodotropheus Sprengerea x 5

Plus I have a 5" ABN that's in there now.

If I'm able to find groups of juvies and they are raised together, does the typical 1 male for so many females apply?

 

[master chi]

Everything sounds good.Except you will need to add another 10 to 15 demasoni.

See the thing is Demasoni are known for their aggression. experts agree,the only way to deal with that is to house them in much larger groups.

The cool thing is it will only add character,and activity to your tank. But yeah you will have to buy more of them.

Going with demasoni is still a good choice i think. If you get 20 of them at least a couple subdominant males will need to be rehomed,eventually. As they mature extra males who find themselves hiding behind filter intakes,heaters,or top corners of the tank should be removed,especially if they have any signs of nipped fins or bite marks of any kind.

Demasoni are known as the extra work fish for just this reason. But it is well worth the work,once you have a nice colony.

Honestly,I think the fish you've chosen all contrast each other well. I,myself would not be against doing colonies of all 3 species in a tank,as long as the filtration met the needs of this kind of overstocking.

The truth is you want to do 1 species(Demasoni) who is suggested to keep as a colony,and the 2 other species you want to keep are known as the most peaceful mbuna there is,So 3 colonies together could work in terms of extra males being tolerant of each other. But it's something only an experienced mbuna keeper should try.

**Note** When I mention colonies,I'm referring to keeping 3 harem groups of the same species together in the same tank.For whatever reason 2 harems will just not work. But 3 seems to be a magic number.The most agreed reason for this is that there will always be 1 dominant male. If he has only 1 subdominant male to harass,he will drive that subdommale into submission. If he has 2 subdoms to chase,the aggression is spread enough for those subdoms to thrive,
Plus there will be 9 to 12 females to chase as well, spreading aggression even further.

For you though I could suggest adding an extra group of females per species,instead of trying colonies. The result is almost exactly the same,A busier tank...again the filtration is the determining factor here..

 

[Anthraxx]

i do one male period.. anything more and the females get punked far to much. just my opinion here, but i also think demasoni are going to be a tough one for a first trip down african lane. ive tried starting with 15 in a 6 ft tank and they just killed themselves off, ended up having to sell em off as i got sick of finding dead fish. id sub them for acei (even tho acei get huge)

 

[cichlid-gal]

Just as pretty as demasoni but not near as mean are Pseudotropheus saulosi. A much better temperament on them. Might be worth the look. It's easier to change your stocking now rather than later.

 

[Betty]

If you decide to go with demasoni, I agree with upping the number to about a dozen.  I used to keep them years ago and was very lucky -- I started with five and was able to save the first couple of spawns to get my numbers up.  I saw a lot of chasing, but never experienced the kind of aggression that most people see with them.  They were one of my favorites!

Saulosi are a good choice as well, but with the females being yellowish in color, I don't think I'd mix them with the labs.

 

[bronzefighter]

Ok, if I upped the number of demasoni, would I still be able to keep the other 2 species as well? The tank is a 4' long 55, and I'm still trying to get a hold of an "appropriate" level of overstocking.

If I scrapped the demasoni's what would be my other options?

I've thought about a spieces only tank with p saulosi, but I'd love to have more colors than just blue and yellow.

what would your ideal stocking be?

 

[master chi]

you wouldn't have to go species only with saulosi..

I think the issue with saulosi,at least for me is this.Only the males show the blue barring..  Going with a standard 1M/4F leaves only 1 blue barred fish in the whole tank.If you want to have a tank with blue bars,and saulosi,you have to get 3 males and 9 females....The colony I referred to earlier... If you did that it would be fine.. But then you should not keep the labs,because saulosi females are also yellow.. That's where Demasoni come into play... But  You could just try


1M/4F Cynotilapia of choice
1M/4F YellowLabs
1M/4F Rusty

That way you wouldn't have to get demasoni,they would be replaced by the Cynotilapia species.
Anthraxx,does give good advice,and is correct that Demasoni are not usually suggested for new mbuna keepers. But when you start with a colony,the chances for success are much better. I do think his experience with them is less the norm in that case,but also not a rare case by any means.
As I stated earlier demasoni are indeed the extra work fish.Also I have found sometimes that removing subdoms is not always the best course of action. If one male is too bullish,it may be he who has to go. Leaving the formerly,subdom male to become the dominant one. This practice can also backfire sometimes.The new dominant male may actually end up being more bullish than the one removed.For me it's easy because I'm allowed multiple tanks  throughout my home. That makes it much simpler to rehome,remove,or change out fish who don't foot the bill. but an extra 10 or 20 gallon tank should do just fine for a timeout demasoni.

As for ideal stock.. This would look best for you,while keeping the DWARF mbuna profile...

1M/4F Cyno.Sp. White top Hara
1M/4F Rusties
1M/4F Yellow Labs

If you want to overstock,simply add extra females of each species,something I always do..

There are other mbuna who can fit in a 55,that are not considered dwarf.  Anthraxx mentioned Acei,and for the reason of them getting as large as they do,I did not suggest them. Some mbuna keepers say they get to big for a 55,which honestly,just depends on whether or not your dominant male reaches a size of 8 inches or more. That's something that can happen,especially in the aquarium,but it doesn't always happen,and Acei are definitely more on the peaceful side in mbuna terms.

If you were to step away from dwarf mbuna something like this might look really cool

1M/4F Metriaclima Caillainos
1M/4FYellow Labs
1M/6F Ps. Cyaneorhabdos


Or..
1M/4F Ps. Acei
1M/4F  Metriaclima Sp. Dolphin.(Giant Demasoni)  which only look,not act like their dwarf counterpart
1M/4F Yellow Labs

I know you wanted a dwarf tank,which is why all my previous suggestions included no metriaclima species,or Acei,because those guys get so big. Still,it might help stir your imagination,if you think a little outside your own lines...

 

[master chi]

I should have also mentioned that  there are some real stunners in the Cynotilapia group......:shock: 

 

[Anonymous]

Nice cichlids. Master chi. :spoton: 
And great advice. I learn new things here once awhile here.

 

[bronzefighter]

Wow, thank you so much for your help! I'm thinking the Rusties and Labs plus a Cyno of choice would be prime for me. Now to just source my fish :spoton: 

 

[Anonymous]

Now to just source my fish :spoton: 

If not here on Washingtonfishbox.com or LFS. Go look at the wet spot.. heard they got alot of different african cichlids that you wont find here locally.