65g...what to do?

[GreenMan]

Hi again. In continuing a previous discussion I though I'd start a new thread due to with my existing fish. I essentially now have a blank tank, so to speak. I just rehomed both my angelfish and Bolivian rams. Now I only have a small school of serpae tetras and a small school of Cardinals which I'm willing to rehome if necessary.

I'm writing here because I've become quite a cichlid enthusiast (in my limited experience with angelfish and rams) and would like to have more experience with different types. So I'm here to ask your advice on how to stock a 65 as a display tank in my living room for maximum color, motion and interaction. Here's the environment I will have:

- 65 gallon tank 36w x 18d x 25h (very tall tank)
- Pressurized CO2
- Goal is a heavily planted tank but willing to rethink...
- High light
- Large eheim canister filter
- wonderful complicated wood structure
- excellent rocks, caves and hiding places
- I can use either eco-complete, black sand or a combination as a substrate
- I consistently do water large water changes about 1x week

You have given me excellent advise in past threads on this topic and now that my angelfish are rehomed I was hoping you could give me similar advise considering the tank is basically empty. I am still seeking a relatively peaceful tank with as many South American fish as possible but still comfortably fit in a tank that size.

In the past blue acaras have been mentioned and that is a top runner for me (not electric). I'm also interested in Red Head Tapajos, Firemouths, Severums, possibly more angelfish, German Rams, Discus, Apistogrammas, any other geophagus. What mix would you suggest in both species and especially numbers?

Thanks.

 

[sir_keith]

A couple of quick thoughts-

(1) Since I am at least partially responsible for planting the 'blue acara seed,' I'd like to rescind that suggestion. At the time, I thought your 65g tank was 4 feet long, not 3, which makes a big difference. If you look online, you will find that opinion is about equally divided between those that say blue acaras can be kept in tanks as small as 30g, while others say that 55g is a minimum. I am in the latter camp.

(2) From the list of fishes you suggested, I still think that you are focusing on fishes that will outgrow your tank. Far better that the tank be too big for your fishes than vice versa. And resist the temptation to overstock.

(3) Since your tank is tall, think about layers. At substrate level, South American dwarf cichlids; there are many beautiful, interesting fishes in this group, and some of them grow to a decent size. Mid-water? I hate to say it, but how about Angels? Crenicara would be another interesting option. Upper level- some peaceful schooling fish, like some of the smaller rainbows (e.g. the Celebes Rainbow), or any number of tetras; these are lovely kept in groups.

(4) Forget about Geos, Firemouths, Severums, etc. for now; you're just asking for trouble in a tank this size. Discus should also be off the table because of their high maintenance needs. That leaves dwarf cichlids, angels, and dithers. IMO, dwarf cichlids do everything that big cichlids do, they just come in smaller, more manageable packages, which are better suited to your needs.

In your post you said-

'I am still seeking a relatively peaceful tank with as many South American fish as possible but still comfortably fit in a tank that size.'

If that's the question, the answer is simple- dwarf cichlids.

Good luck.

 

[VickiK]

Great question @GreenMan and awesome answer @sir_keith -- I'm anxious to see what others might say.

In my biggest tank, 50 or 55 - can't remember, I have a SHOW going on 24/7 with this collection. Everyone gets along... everyone's busy.. there's schooling and not schooling = something for everyone. I really like lots of small fish in a big big tank.
4 Congo Tetras - 2 male, 2 female (which spawn frequently)
1 Amazon Puffer
1 Male Betta
1 Dwarf Frog
A dozen Rummy Nose Tetras
Two kinds of long fin danios - about 4-5 of each kind (I've really fallen for these)
A few lamp eye tetras
2 SAEs
Snails
1 giant "Eclipse" catfish (we determined what he really is in another thread)

 

[GreenMan]

sir_keith, like VickiK said, that is an awesome answer with a lot of thought and insight. You've succeeded in changing how I think about this tank and my expectations. Yes, I'm frustrated that I can't have a larger tank at this time but there really is a lot of potential if I stick with the types of fish this size tank is best for. I'm probably going back to angelfish, I'd also put some dwarfs in there and a large school of tetras. I'll hold off on the larger cichlids for now until I have the room for bigger tanks in my house.

I've been advised (by a hardcore angelfish guy) that I could fit up to 10 angels in my tank (long term). That seems like too many, I'm thinking more like 5-7 but either way the goal would be to have a 'shoal' and if things get too hairy I'd remove (or add) some of them.

As for the dwarfs I'm still thinking GBR's or apistos.

Tetras, I love the personality and style of my serpae tetras and will likely add to their school, plus, despite the nippy meme for serpaes, my experience has been that they have NEVER come close to nipping the fin of any fish in my tank, especially the angelfish.

VickiK, that sounds like a very fun tank. I would LOVE to have a frog in my tank too but I'm afraid it would be eaten by the angels. Do you have any pics? I'd like to see them.

 

[VickiK]

The angels? Sure. Here's The Smothers Brothers. Tommy has a heart on his side.

Photobomb is by a very busy Long Finned Rosy Barb who never stops moving....

 

[GreenMan]

Great name...I remember the Smothers Brothers! Great fish. Thanks for the pics.

 

[dwarfpike]

Apistos (except the two species found in the wild with blue rams) would be a better match for the angels, temp wise. Blue rams are often kept at elevated temps that the angels would live in, but not thrive in.

And the seprae fin nipping isn't just a meme, the ones I had in with my blue acaras nipped down the dorsal fin trailers before the pair wiped them out. Of course I only had 12 of them in the tank, larger numbers help avoid such behavior in fin nippers such as tiger barbs.

 

[GreenMan]

dwarfpike, it's so strange that everyone has such different experiences with the same fish. I see conflicting information all over the internet when researching fish. I spend a lot of time watching my tank because it's by my desk and over the past year I've never once seen my tetras even come close to nipping a fin on another fish. They just play with each other all day and when they get tired they chill out in the stem plants. Your experience has been very different. We're both absolutely correct and wrong at the same time!

I think this is one of the oddest things about this hobby.... there are absolutely no absolutes when it comes to fish. Since they react to so many variables such as water, tank size, plants, light, tank mates, food, age, etc. there is no way to predict what a fish will do, or what size it will grow to or anything else for that matter.

As a relative newcomer to the hobby I constantly look for information and get very frustrated by this reality. The only way to really KNOW is to experience it for yourself. But, when you only have one tank it can be very frustrating. You guys have been a great help and have given me about the best advice I've received so thank you for that.

 

[lloyd378]

I recently bought some of the orange flash apistos that were advertised on here. I’ve got five males growing out in my daughters 40b (36x18x18) and they are super fun to watch swim in and out of all the wood I out in her tank...... ( I’m also growing out 10 1/2” amphilophus Chanco in with the apistos until they reach the 1-1.5” mark)

Apistos would have my vote!

 

[Livebearer Lady]

You mentioned Cichilds. what about the "Central" American species??? There are alot of smaller fishes 4" and under that are milded mannered that could co-exited in this wonderful boitop you have created, but you did not mention how long it was up and running??? I could hook you up with some wonderful species you and your living room would LOVE!!!
Ohh forgot to mention "dither" fishes for these are wild-type livebearers which ther are many species some very rare indeed